Andy, believe me m8, ive never been in any cliques, especially not on this forum and you can ask anyone about that

Joe I can see why. I can also see that in such a situation that one should not rush to pass judgement especially when one is part of the team running the league. In this case, I would ask you to please email Mark so he can clear my horses and I will be more than happy to provide ALL my ttf.dat files for him to check. You are wrong in your assumption that I have done this and I again state categorically that I have not done any breeding in an Aussie game before today.

FWIW I'll accept your apology and apologise for my own posts. It is too easy to post on a board and sometimes posts should be done with a cooler head.

I didn't say you were part of a clique. It's the impression I get when two members of the league administration team are arguing these points with me.

Im not really part of the team running the league, I have minimal contact with those running the league, only on rare occasions there is a problem with ratings, I update ratings and put them in dropbox, that is as far as my involvement in the running of the league goes.

I speak for myself.

Fair enough. And I can respect your Glaswegian bluntness . Lord knows I do the same myself.

FWIW to bring this back to this topic. I really do think Mark needs to do something about this and I also think for the sake of the league (and me of course) he needs to look at the horses already uploaded and issue a statement as to which trainers have used this bug as I know there is at least one (myself excluded) who has.

Definitely needs to be sorted, how do you know of one who has used it?

What can we do now, only two options, either make it allowed and then everyone will have to breed in AUS and export to UK or patch the game and make everyone start from scratch.

Because I didn't understand why the horses I was seeing had absolutely full potential bars and I didn't ask because I simply assumed it was something you could breed in and never clarified why but when you look at stat bars as much as I do it's something that hit me between the eyes. We're talking full as we're seeing with Aussie bred horses and when this post came up yesterday I understood why at last.

Here's Domnu's potential bar. See the difference? I'm willing to post them for my entire league team. None will look like the absolute max bars that you see with the Aussie bred horses.

But Mark can confirm that just as easily I'm sure in case anyone thinks I am editing the pictures.

Im sure I had one 3yo who was full in the UK but it was already full as a 2yo if I remember right, never done well in CK. 99.99% of mine dont go full till 4 but it can happen because ive seen it myself. The weird thing about it is not just the full potential bar, its also the enormous improvement in the CK which is not just down to 5% of the potential bar.

I really don't think it needs to be as extreme as that. Ask Mark it may be that he can simply adjust the horse files exported. This season is done anyway. Next season can be sorted out during the break. Personally I don't like this bug and would prefer Mark to remove it and I know my horses will perform the same .

As for the improvement in CK well that I would like to see reversed.

Believe me Joe when I say there's maximum potential as in the UK horses at 3 who then increase their potential by a sliver at 4/5. Look at the pics I've posted previously there is a subtle difference. The Aussie horses have maximum potential at 3 that you see for horses at 4/5 in the UK. And that makes identifying these horses easy. Whether they breed on that way in coming seasons I don't know.. I haven't had a chance to play around with it yet but I intend to.

The problem is as I see it- Aus bred horses, when exportedto another country,show marked improvement in ck both over the ck form they would give if kept in Aus and similarly bred horses from other countries. The solution therefore, would be to stop this ck improvement when transferring countries, and at the same time level the playing field for countries such as Ireland. Clearly the problem is in the transferring from country to country as the Aus horses only show an improvement when moving from Aus to Uk, as in Aus there times are slower. Has anyone actually tested a Uk bred horse, first when exported to ck from uk and then to ck from Aus to see if there's a difference on that front? If there is no difference then we can conclude that the potential bars are irrelevant- it's all in the transferring.
As for the accusations, if Andy believes someone to have utilised this cheat, he should inform the league authorities to check out said suspect, but what has to be beared in mind is that if its all in the transferring then if the person has bred them in Aus and exported them from Aus they may not have gained.
To accuse Andy is possibly unfair, particularly if you look at his 2yos who probably have a uk flag next to them, meaning they must be uk bred, and I think the fact that , even though he put it incredibly ungraciously, he has improved his horses times implies he had not used this glitch and we should take his word on it. And without meaning to cause offence, to level out the criticism slightly, when the Duke made his revelation you Paul were not quick to see the bad points of this case and instead implied you were eager to use this, before changing your viewpoint after people complained.

So, my solution would be:
•Get Mark to release a patch that removes the advantage gained in Ck by transferring Aus bred horses to the Uk- this is the real problem
•Get Mark to conduct a 'drugs test' if such a thing is possible, on all group 1 winners, to see if anybody has utilised the glitch
•Not make any accusations until there is full evidence- lets keep the league sweet
•It needs to be tested whether a Uk bred runs any worse in Ck when exported from Aus compared to when exported from Uk, and also whether these Aus bred horses in the Uk then pass on there superiority in ck onto their offspring.

A final word, as has been said before- if horses have benefitted, they still need to be good horses. The gains are not enough to turn a crap horse into a champion. It's like giving drugs to horses- it is unfair, but giving drugs to a claimer is not going to make it a Derby winner

Ubar i was the one person who came forward and provided the evidence so if i wanted to use this for an advantage
i would have kept my mouth shut would i not

The Duke said horses gain potential quicker in the aussie game

it was me that made the discovery that if you transfer back and forwards you could gain half a second off your best ck time

when i thought about what i had found and i thought about it this is when it dawned on me that it would be terrible if
anybody did this to gain an advantage in the lge this season which FWIW i don't think anybody has



what i said yesterday about the aussie game was tongue in cheek i never actually believed this could make such a huge difference
i actually laughed it off but thought id see for myself and was blown away with the results
which i posted here instantly

then Andy thinks i am pointing the finger at him
then i get accused of being in a cliche
i like joe he is a good guy but to be honest we have prob sent 1 email to each other since the start of the lge
which was to set stuff up
and now you ubar saying i wanted to use this system to gain an advantage

just feel a bit disillusioned about today

a few beers and a nights sleep i will prob feel better about things

i hope so

all i have EVER done in my involvement in the lge is to try and help make it better

sorry for rant long day


anyway heading out

I'm not trying to create an argument or accuse anyone of anything but my point was that everyone has said some incriminating stuff so rather than have a go at Andy or Doc everyone should just make sure they are entirely free of any potentially hypocritical stuff before they say anything. I haven't said anything bad about snyone, I'm just pointing out that everyone has said stuff in this case that could be taken the wrong way, so we shouldn't jump to conclusions so quickly about what others say.
Using this purely as an example-



Whether this is tongue in cheek or not, which I'm not disputing, it could come across rather differently to how you meant it, and this could be said about any comments made on this topic, which is my point - make sure what you post can't be taken the wrong way, otherwise we get the situation we had today - people said stuff that was taken the wrong way- arguments followed.

I've entered Australian horses in the league. Am I a cheat as well? Maybe Andy and myself are in this together and have known all along?


The plot thickens. Luckily we have some of the greatest minds on the case.

I don't quite get who the sarcasm is directed at there as the general consensus is to try and get Mark to fix the issues, so it sounds like you're directing that at Mark himself

How many of your league team are British?